Author Topic: Eviscerate and Pummel  (Read 2179 times)

VaeliusNoctu

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Eviscerate and Pummel
« on: May 01, 2015, 09:28:01 PM »
Hello,

i think that these both Feats needs some Balance.

1) Pummel should have a Damage from 25% and a Hitchance from 125-150% so that this feat have a good chance to Land and do his Job. With a cooldown from 3 Turns it realy should hit most of the time you use it.

I mean you use them against targets with heavy dodge (not evasion standard like) and with high dodge this special attack fails to often.

In a cooperative Gameplay it maybe good. Attack a target reduce evasion and you Teamplayer shots, or with a Hybrid Character Melee and Guns/Crossbows. But atm this feat is mah...

2) Eviscerate i think is a bit counterproductive if you go for bleeding Wounds.

With Bleeding wounds you go most for "Taste for Blood" and "Vile Weaponry". The Bleeding Wound counters you need for both especielly for Taste for Blood (i think after the Infected Counters appears he needs no more the Bleeding counters but im not 100% sure).

After my Experiences you get with High DEX around 2-4 most 3 bleeding wounds in a normal fight. Thats 200-250% Damage for Eviscerate. Its counterproductive remove the Bleeding wounds and weak Taste for Blood feat, maybe as a finisher so this MOB dont survive this round and cann attack you.

But better would be change that Feat so he works together with the other Feats, or give him a Stun effect for maybe 1 Turn or for every Bleeding wound on the target. So if the Target survives its stuned.

The other feats i can test are Well Balanced in my opinion.

Greetz

VN
« Last Edit: May 01, 2015, 10:56:23 PM by VaeliusNoctu »

SagaDC

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Re: Eviscerate and Pummel
« Reply #1 on: May 13, 2015, 02:27:16 AM »
I'd definitely agree that Pummel needs some kind of buff. It's currently relatively useless since, as you stated, the whole point of the skill is for enemies with high Dodge - but then when you try to Pummel them, they just dodge it! An accuracy buff definitely seems like the way to go for it. Heck, I wouldn't even mind having the move do no damage, if it hit automatically! You're using the move for the utility of the debuff anyway, not the damage.

I'm not so sure about Eviscerate, though. Prior to the nerfing, Eviscerate had absolutely insane damage potential against organic targets (especially if you "stacked" your bleeding procs with bladed armor and/or boots and a serrated knife or bladed combat gloves), and it's still pretty wicked. With my recent high-dex fist weapons build, I had up to  eighteen bleeding procs per turn (for an average of six or seven bleeding wounds per turn). That meant I could end most turns with an Eviscerate "nuke" that would do 400-450% damage (100% base weapon damage + 50% per bleeding wound) if I needed to finish off my enemy before ending my turn. Since the enemy would generally be dead after that attack anyway, it didn't matter if they were still bleeding or not afterwards.

hilf

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Re: Eviscerate and Pummel
« Reply #2 on: May 17, 2015, 08:06:24 AM »
I'd definitely agree that Pummel needs some kind of buff. It's currently relatively useless since, as you stated, the whole point of the skill is for enemies with high Dodge - but then when you try to Pummel them, they just dodge it! An accuracy buff definitely seems like the way to go for it.
Couldn't agree more.

I'm not so sure about Eviscerate, though. Prior to the nerfing, Eviscerate had absolutely insane damage potential against organic targets (especially if you "stacked" your bleeding procs with bladed armor and/or boots and a serrated knife or bladed combat gloves), and it's still pretty wicked. With my recent high-dex fist weapons build, I had up to  eighteen bleeding procs per turn (for an average of six or seven bleeding wounds per turn). That meant I could end most turns with an Eviscerate "nuke" that would do 400-450% damage (100% base weapon damage + 50% per bleeding wound) if I needed to finish off my enemy before ending my turn. Since the enemy would generally be dead after that attack anyway, it didn't matter if they were still bleeding or not afterwards.

The important question is: how much health your target has after you hit him 18 times? Sure i did crit arena champion for 2k damage (almost half of it was resisted) but he had less than 100HP left.


Eviscerate+TfB is much less problematic than it used to be:
1. TfB caps at 10 stack - you need to hit fewer times to hit the cap.
2. Killing blows grant 1 stack of TfB so you can refresh by killing things with Eviscerate.
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VaeliusNoctu

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Re: Eviscerate and Pummel
« Reply #3 on: May 17, 2015, 10:06:43 AM »
Good to know that i used it wrong (eviscerate) and its not a wasted feat. Maybe to use it sensfull you must waste defense for Bleeding wound Upgrades for the Armors (boots, Body Armor). For a knife, fists, fist Weapon user its -in my opinion, not a good idea go for Riot or Metal Gear (high armor penalty) so maybe some Bleeding Wound Boots was a help.

Btw i use infused siphoner leather armor and tabi boots so i dont have any Parts in my armor that do bleeding wounds and i use seretaed electroshock knifes. So maybe that the reason i have less bleeding wounds, i only get some from the knife. Maybe i try some different boots.

And its true what hilf sayd, after you have enough bleeding wounds on your target that it give a nice Damage boost your target is

1. Dead 5 Hits bevore^^

2. Have only a few HP left

It seems eviscerate is more a finisher if you calcultate that normal attacks do:

1) not stun finaly
or
2) not kill a Mob

Ruigi

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Re: Eviscerate and Pummel
« Reply #4 on: June 22, 2015, 10:39:51 PM »
I would not want to see pummel lose it's damage.

It's an essential third attack for sledgehammer characters and purely on that account it is worth it.

It allows a sledgehammer character to finish off a near dead enemy that otherwise would have had a chance to attack again.

An accuracy buff would be nice, but pummel is very important for sledgehammer characters regardless. If anything, I would argue for reduction in cooldown time to once per turn.

My only gripe is the name. "Pummel" is a wrestling move, "Pommel" is the knob attached to the handle of a swinging weapon.

Really the move should be called "Pommel" or "Pommel strike"
« Last Edit: June 22, 2015, 10:46:38 PM by Ruigi »

Grombolar

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Re: Eviscerate and Pummel
« Reply #5 on: June 26, 2015, 02:08:31 AM »
It allows a sledgehammer character to finish off a near dead enemy that otherwise would have had a chance to attack again.
Used Dirty Kick (15 AP) or fists do the same job (Pummel seems to be 10 AP), so I never even bothered wasting a feat for it, hm. It just simply doesn't look handy enough without +attack change %

Ruigi

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Re: Eviscerate and Pummel
« Reply #6 on: June 26, 2015, 03:59:08 PM »
at the higher levels, pummel will do significantly more damage than fists.

Also, against crippling strike foes, pummel will allow you to continue to hit them.

You can get around accuracy issues by stunning or blinding the enemy first, then use pummel.

My biggest issue with pummel is the cooldown, not the accuracy.

I'm not sure why there's a cooldown in the first place.

UnLimiTeD

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Re: Eviscerate and Pummel
« Reply #7 on: June 26, 2015, 05:56:00 PM »
So you don't use it as a third attack.  8)
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Ruigi

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Re: Eviscerate and Pummel
« Reply #8 on: June 26, 2015, 07:20:41 PM »
I think it deserves to have a 1 turn cooldown.

It requires a feat an is only useful to specialized sledgehammer characters.