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General / Re: feedback about my last build
« Last post by epeli on October 17, 2017, 07:17:48 AM »
Many builds indeed get noticeable benefits from venturing in the 10+ region, I'm not denying that.

For a somewhat relevant example, if lewis_cb is planning on using crossbows for crowd control with special bolts (instead of leveraging psi cc to help crossbow precision) with 10 per, that would probably necessitate the of use standard scopes to keep hit chances at comfortable levels. Especially against particularly evasive enemies and/or without night vision.

Anyways, I just wanted to take a moment to write down and clarify (to myself, at least) how much 10 to 16 base ability really does. I actually thought the skill modifier would give bigger total damage increase in some cases, but even without any diminishing or increasing returns the real base ability / skill progression keeps the skill modifier surprisingly consistent. Crazy how solid the core character system is. Most CRPG systems I've delved into (including about 40 MMORPGs - MMO gamedesign is trash, who knew?) have had awful stat scaling/stacking right at their core, but Styg only does that with damage mod stacking in a way that really doesn't matter in a singleplayer game. (You know, things like plasma pistol execute crits hitting for 60x their base damage when you've basically got baseDamage*skillMod*critMod*specialMod and myriads of ways to increase some of the modifiers.)

looks like your playstyle is more focused on defense and mitigating damage rather than spiking the enemy down as fast as possible.
Which is not effective as focusing on damage given nature of games - you are the one, enemies are many, but it doesn't mean it won't work of course.
Yup, offense is best defense. :)
General / Re: The lost train, persuasion and joining the Free Drones
« Last post by epeli on October 17, 2017, 06:16:33 AM »
I should probably reiterate here what I told Phryg yesterday when he asked me about this - I thought you got the option to join FD after persuading them to leave the train and thus save Rail Crossing (even without lying to Herve) as long as you didn't report to SRO.

And in the current bugged iteration (or perhaps it happened only in one of the early 1.0.2 test versions) of the quest, it was possible to save Rail Crossing as a Free Drone which may or may not have been intended.

We should have a dedicated line during the persuation option to tell the Free Drone that we understand their fight against the protectorate but can't condone the fact that they doom Rail Crossing bye stealing the supplies, then let Rail Crossing have the supplies (ie : not lie to the mayor), and then have both choice offer to us.
So basically I'm in favor of this idea. Letting smooth talkers have an option to fix internal issues of the drones (mirroring how you can resolve the protectorate renegade situation) makes them more appealing faction and more impactful persuasion options are always welcome.
General / Re: anti-Carnifex cheese
« Last post by epeli on October 17, 2017, 06:04:02 AM »
I've never done a psi playthrough, maybe I should try before Styg nerfs it all to oblivion. :D Honestly though, every time I encounter an enemy that uses one of the abilities that ignore all defenses, I die a little inside. It's aggravating.

But back to the taser, the 3-turn cooldown is more than enough to prevent it from being OP in the player's hands. But if there ever comes a day when Styg decides to give it to enemies as well, I'll be the first one screaming for nerfs.
Heh, psi is only getting better with Temporal Manipulation. Besides, Styg already nerfed it to oblivion back in alpha! :P Yup, we're living in a post-psinerf era. If you can imagine playing psi without having to pay attention to psi costs or range, that's what it was like. Pure psi is still OP once you get the hang of it, but the current form with tiny psi pool and regen is more interesting to play. Now if only we could have Mind Darts put back into the game...

The taser is really nice, it makes many characters more fun to play at low levels when your toolset is very limited. And for some, it continues to be a trusty tool throughout most of the game. If it was tied to melee its appeal would be much more limited.

I don't think Styg will give tasers to human enemies, certain nice things are meant to be available only to crafters.
But I honestly would love to see enemies use some of the crafting-only goods like tasers and all the different armor parts. It would add variation and make crafting slightly less mandatory. You know how big of a difference it makes to your gunner when the RNG gods have chosen to equip bandits with anti-rifle vests? I want more of that. Imagine lobbing a high tier grenade at some zoners, only to see them survive? Damn blast coats... Or nanocomposite plates unexpectedly ruining your nice crits. Nowadays you always know from the graphics when someone is wearing fireproof tinfoil coils.

In that case, shouldn't you be screaming already? Or have you never stood next to a sentry bot?
Uh, apparently I haven't, not on the enemy turn at least. I've only played with different ranged builds, though, and as far as I remember the bots always either shoot back or launch a flashbang, instead of trying to use the taser.
Yeah, sentry bot tasers are pretty easy to avoid (even as melee - just move out of range before ending your turn.) Fun fact: they had integrated tasers years before players could craft them.

Don't you dare touch my psi, evil moderator person  >:(
Don't worry, Styg is planning no inappropriate psi touching. And would you believe, he is the only moderator around here. The man loves his spambots too much to let anyone else touch them!
General / Re: feedback about my last build
« Last post by Bruno on October 17, 2017, 05:38:36 AM »
Consider that for weapon base abilities, even going from 10 to 16 increases your weapon damage only by 20% at level 25 (skill modifier from 242% to 290%) or the other way around, going from 16 to 10 lowers damage by 16%. That difference alone is not worth whopping 6 base points. But:
- Strength also gets you weapon-specific melee damage bonus (12%-60%) on top of that.
- Dexterity gives 18% light weapon AP cost reduction and 6% melee critical chance. Also precision for throwing.
- Perception increases precision. This might not be very useful with psi on the side, as you have many ways to nullify enemy evasion. It also increases detection, but at 10 per it's already good enough.
- Will is different. Instead of skill damage bonus, each psi ability has its own scaling similar to crafting components. Most psi abilities arguably scale better than any of the above stuff, while some don't scale at all.

The problem is not with damage but with accuracy. 10 ability might work for some build but it's just detrimental for others.
Depends on fighting style I think. If you like stealth/ambush, or high initiative and/or mobile smg burst attacks, where you get into the enemys face before firing, 10 PER should be more than enough.

For ranged sharpshooter/Xbow shooting, a couple more points in PER would not hurt. Still 16 is overkill, stat points are too useful for everything, not only offense.
Bugs / Institute cutscene
« Last post by Sanger on October 17, 2017, 05:21:09 AM »
There's a slight problem with the cutscene that triggers when you approach the Institute after locating the Cube in Core City. The fog of war (for want of a better term) lifts as the camera pans towards the gates so that you can observe the conversation between Efreitor Denzil and the Rassophore, but once the conversation begins, the fog of war returns and you can't actually see who is talking.
General / Re: feedback about my last build
« Last post by Sanger on October 17, 2017, 03:28:38 AM »
My gut feeling is that spreading yourself so thin would make your offensive ability significantly weaker than other builds in the late game, and that the free attacks wouldn't make up for the lack of specialisation, but I'm interested in the idea of a build focused on free attacks, regardless. If you try it, let us know how it goes.
General / Re: The lost train, persuasion and joining the Free Drones
« Last post by Sanger on October 17, 2017, 03:23:39 AM »
Uh, it's a bug. IIRC You're not supposed to have the [Lie] option after persuading the Drones to hand over the train, and thus none of the weird "you messed up our plans real bad but we still really like you" gets to happen. However, I could leave the lie option for those players who want to be absolute jerks, as Sanger pointed out, but the Drones won't approach you after that, of course.

What do you guys think?

I would probably just remove the option, but I do see why you'd leave it in just to give the player the ability to make mistakes. In either case though, it definitely ought to lock you out of both factions.
Bugs / Small graphical glitch with large gates
« Last post by Crowley on October 17, 2017, 12:36:00 AM »
I noticed that when walking through large hydraulic gates along the bottom edge, the layering doesn't quite work properly. See the attached picture.
General / Re: anti-Carnifex cheese
« Last post by TheAverageGortsby on October 16, 2017, 11:21:06 PM »
Let's compare that with psi buttons. "For 0 AP cost, all enemies are removed from combat for 3 turns oh and by the way your next attack against them is doubled lol" and you think taser needs nerfing? :P
Don't you dare touch my psi, evil moderator person  >:(

::Continues to headbang to "Firestarter" while running around as a pillar of flame::
General / Re: anti-Carnifex cheese
« Last post by Hazard on October 16, 2017, 10:51:56 PM »
In that case, shouldn't you be screaming already? Or have you never stood next to a sentry bot?
Uh, apparently I haven't, not on the enemy turn at least. I've only played with different ranged builds, though, and as far as I remember the bots always either shoot back or launch a flashbang, instead of trying to use the taser.
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