Underrail Forum
Underrail => General => Topic started by: lewis_cb on October 15, 2017, 01:05:03 pm
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Hi all,
This is my first post in the forum. First, congratulations for the superb game and community.
The game mechanics and diversity of viable strategies and builds got me hooked really hard!
Unwittingly, I already rerolled my character twice to try more powerful or appealing things.
Hopefully, you can help me pick and tweak the last one :o
I thought about 3 variations of a bowyer+psier, which I find the most fun & strategical route. The idea is getting many free actions (Commando, Special Tactics, Premeditation...). Pics of the 3 can be seen here: https://imgur.com/a/kgDZX
QBit1: http://underrail.info.tm/build/?AwGloJgVhB2OQGYkgIynSAbGxMN5hHjFFQbCiwwAsNcq2MqhLzhJkjiyi9NEEDWQ0AHCCg4sjLMiw5YyWPVgKAnGmBYgA
(+): This one would wear X3 reinforced super steel armor & boots (trying to keep Tranquility up), adaptive NVG,
combine cheap psi casts (when full HP, Adrenaline user, Thermodynamicity)
with double 9-bullet-33AP-bleeding Hornet bursts (Commando, Concentrated Fire, Expertise & Vile Weaponry) (Smart or Compensated?) and
17-AP-Pneumatic-AA Zephyr critical special bolts (every 6 turns trying to incapacitate all mobs for Special Tactics free bolt with flashbangs,Locus+Breakdown...)
together with Quick Tinkering & Deadly Snares and best traps.
(-): low initiative could make Tranquility pointless,
no mobility (unless easy/kiteable mobs, use tactical vest there) reduces Quick Tinkering utility to melees,
no lockpicking/hacking,
low HP.
QBit2: http://underrail.info.tm/build/?AwGloJgVhB2EYGYTIIypK09WJqXfMYgFnGIIE4QAObANhBI1mVhs0TT06PIhAQMXFCSYCSyKI3oZ6yetVZwYWNMEaoINIA
(+): Very similar. Same armor but now with striders & Armor Sloping for 20 MP/turn,
Ambush, Psiostatic Electricity, Focus Stim, Seeker NVG & Bowyer for critical shots,
this time 7-bullet-33AP-incendiary Chimera bursts (to make bursts a CC & Ambush tool)
and same 17-AP Zephyr special bolts (no trap specialisation).
(-): low initiative could make Tranquility pointless,
low mobility,
no lockpicking/hacking,
low HP.
Gambit: http://underrail.info.tm/build/?AwGloJgVhBmEbwJwhQRlAdjDtsbggAcKS2hhRoVIALGiJvDXjKyOxSBMXPLLTo9a8WoKgA2EBIaYYSeUQ7B4GKWghEgA
(+): wearing Infused Ancient Rathound armor, reinforced SSteel boots, Seeker NVG / Critical Psiband,
high-HP evasive high-resistance (~60% mech) and high-DR (~50% mech,heat,cold @30%HP with Conditioning, Soticism, Lifting Belt, Ancient),
focus on versatile criticals with Bowyer, Psiostatic Electricity, Focus Stim, critical headgear, Ambush & Survival Instincts,
no AR but instead can combine 25-AP-Scoped-AA & 17-AP-Pneumatic-AA Zephyr special bolts (no trap specialisation).
(-): low initiative,
no lockpicking/hacking.
-Is a playthrough without lockpicking/hacking very lackluster (won't find good crafting materials)?
-How easily can you keep 100% HP for Tranquility with heavy armor & shield?
I thought of using Junkyard Surprise for -1/2 Con (123HP) & best Regenerative Vest (+55HP whenever HP<86) to automatically go 100%HP if 68<HP<86 :o
-Also, how bad is to be a turtle with only 10MP or 20MP?
Sorry for the length of the post. I read very good posts here and thought I could give it a try.
Any feedback is very welcome :)
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Generally speaking a 10 in your base stat for your attacks is going to make the lategame hard. 10 is very low at level 25. UnderRail rewards specialization. I would encourage you to specialize more heavily. Here's my two cents:
That first build is just a mess. You are going to want to find a few more points for Traps, even if you wear the Trappers Belt and carry Jackknife; you want 95 traps to be able to disarm everything in the base game. You either need a few more points in Chemistry (if you want to make high-tier grenades) or else pull a few points out and drop some of them into Bio (you'll want to cook Super Soldier, if you're using xbows) and bank the rest. As mentioned before, splitting into gun+bows as well as heavy psi means you're only moderately good at any of them. The uncontested nature of Psi attacks means your Psi will be comparatively stronger than your guns and bows at high levels because enemies have reasonably good Dodge&Evasion.
The second build is perhaps even worse. That tiny bit of Stealth isn't going to help at all, especially knocked down by your armor penalty, so pull those points back. If you had a specific reason to put 19 points into Traps, then go ahead, but otherwise pull them back as well; you can use Bear Traps at 0 and nothing you can use at sub-30 effective is going to be much more helpful than bear traps. Even with +2 INT Junkyard Surprise and the house crafting bonus, your Mechanics and Tailoring are too low to be useful to you in lategame, and thus they're not really worth that much investment; either get to 50 effective skill to make endless improved repair kits (which will essentially fix your personal money woes forever) or else go about 30 more real points into each so you can make truly quality endgame gear.
The third build is a wash. Don't even try it. With 9 Perception you don't even hit 200 effective skill at level 25 with your bows, and though your stealth will serve you well up to the Institute you'll be hating that investment in Deep Caverns, even if you drop your armor penalty gear in favor of lighter stuff.
None of what I said above matters even a little bit if you're playing on Easy, because on Easy you will absolutely murder anything you find. Even Normal isn't really hard enough to make your builds bad. My comments were entirely based on the assumption that you might want to try them on Hard.
To your additional questions in your OP:
Lockpicking/hacking won't really get you much in the way of crafting mats. If you want crafting mats, get 80 or 110 effective Mercantile and you will have so many mats you won't know what to do with yourself.
Tranq is very easy to keep active for the first turn, and as long as you've got plenty of hypos you'll be fine on subsequent turns as well. DO NOT spec into low health for the hopes of making Regen Vest godly. It won't serve you well ^_^
Turtle isn't bad if you're playing high CON, very heavy armor, and Conditioning. As with other aspects of the game, if you don't specialize for something, it might underwhelm you.
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looks like your playstyle is more focused on defense and mitigating damage rather than spiking the enemy down as fast as possible.
Which is not effective as focusing on damage given nature of games - you are the one, enemies are many, but it doesn't mean it won't work of course.
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Vile Weaponry shouldn't work with guns as they're not cold weapons.
Turtle isn't bad if you're playing high CON, very heavy armor, and Conditioning. As with other aspects of the game, if you don't specialize for something, it might underwhelm you.
IMHO, unless you want to live dangerously with a Survival Instincts build, even 7 CON is enough for a tin can gunner on Hard provided you can craft high quality armors and energy shields. Conditioning is also kinda meh, since it doesn't stack with armor resistances.
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Consider that for weapon base abilities, even going from 10 to 16 increases your weapon damage only by 20% at level 25 (skill modifier from 242% to 290%) or the other way around, going from 16 to 10 lowers damage by 16%. That difference alone is not worth whopping 6 base points. But:
- Strength also gets you weapon-specific melee damage bonus (12%-60%) on top of that.
- Dexterity gives 18% light weapon AP cost reduction and 6% melee critical chance. Also precision for throwing.
- Perception increases precision. This might not be very useful with psi on the side, as you have many ways to nullify enemy evasion. It also increases detection, but at 10 per it's already good enough.
- Will is different. Instead of skill damage bonus, each psi ability has its own scaling similar to crafting components. Most psi abilities arguably scale better than any of the above stuff, while some don't scale at all.
The problem is not with damage but with accuracy. 10 ability might work for some build but it's just detrimental for others.
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My gut feeling is that spreading yourself so thin would make your offensive ability significantly weaker than other builds in the late game, and that the free attacks wouldn't make up for the lack of specialisation, but I'm interested in the idea of a build focused on free attacks, regardless. If you try it, let us know how it goes.
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Consider that for weapon base abilities, even going from 10 to 16 increases your weapon damage only by 20% at level 25 (skill modifier from 242% to 290%) or the other way around, going from 16 to 10 lowers damage by 16%. That difference alone is not worth whopping 6 base points. But:
- Strength also gets you weapon-specific melee damage bonus (12%-60%) on top of that.
- Dexterity gives 18% light weapon AP cost reduction and 6% melee critical chance. Also precision for throwing.
- Perception increases precision. This might not be very useful with psi on the side, as you have many ways to nullify enemy evasion. It also increases detection, but at 10 per it's already good enough.
- Will is different. Instead of skill damage bonus, each psi ability has its own scaling similar to crafting components. Most psi abilities arguably scale better than any of the above stuff, while some don't scale at all.
The problem is not with damage but with accuracy. 10 ability might work for some build but it's just detrimental for others.
Depends on fighting style I think. If you like stealth/ambush, or high initiative and/or mobile smg burst attacks, where you get into the enemys face before firing, 10 PER should be more than enough.
For ranged sharpshooter/Xbow shooting, a couple more points in PER would not hurt. Still 16 is overkill, stat points are too useful for everything, not only offense.
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The second build is perhaps even worse. That tiny bit of Stealth isn't going to help at all, especially knocked down by your armor penalty, so pull those points back. If you had a specific reason to put 19 points into Traps, then go ahead, but otherwise pull them back as well; you can use Bear Traps at 0 and nothing you can use at sub-30 effective is going to be much more helpful than bear traps. Even with +2 INT Junkyard Surprise and the house crafting bonus, your Mechanics and Tailoring are too low to be useful to you in lategame, and thus they're not really worth that much investment; either get to 50 effective skill to make endless improved repair kits (which will essentially fix your personal money woes forever) or else go about 30 more real points into each so you can make truly quality endgame gear.
Just looking at the pros and cons you wrote for each build.
You might want to wait before rolling QBit2, incendiary bullets and psychostatic electricity don't work properly in the current live version. (The bullets don't ignite at all and psychostatic electricity only increases to-get-crit with weapons, not psi.) Will be fixed in the next patch. Soontm.
Your builds seem to have a lot going on for them. Assault rifles, crossbows and throwing with full psi complement... Will you ever find enough APs, carry weight, utility slots, weapon slots and opportunities to use all that stuff? Also you seem to have mixed up Zephyr and Cyclon. 25-AP-Scoped-AA? You can't put two scopes on any weapon.
[...]
Still, Gortsby's point is valid in this case; using completely unrelated weapon skills (per/will based) and having both at 10 is a little low. But it shouldn't be too bad, looks like your playstyle is more focused on defense and mitigating damage rather than spiking the enemy down as fast as possible.
For a somewhat relevant example, if lewis_cb is planning on using crossbows for crowd control with special bolts (instead of leveraging psi cc to help crossbow precision) with 10 per, that would probably necessitate the of use standard scopes to keep hit chances at comfortable levels. Especially against particularly evasive enemies and/or without night vision.
Hi again,
Thank you all for the responses. I'll like to add that my idea was to have a build with many approaches to each combat, even if sub-optimal (sure the AR tin build wrecks havoc but it gets repetitive)...so long it can beat the game!
I've decided I'll try the 2nd build (if ever). The general plan was to have stealth gear to glance at the situation from afar, possibly deploying some Crawler bear traps (my trap skill with EelSandwich+Jackknife is 40!), then change to armored gear and likely choose one of 2 weapon pairs:
-Against ranged enemies, use Pneumatic-AA Zephyr special bolts (21AP) supported by Rapid-Smart Hornet 7mm bursts (27AP)
-Against swarms, melees or armored rivals, pick Rapid-AA Chimera 8mm bursts (33AP) with Pneumatic-AA Cyclon special bolts (17AP)
Seekers NVG (+15% crit) are a must since it improves both (Psi can still be relevant for utility, specially for evasive enemies). Luckily with Stim (+15%), Ambush (+20%, hence 40 stealth) and Psiostatic Electricity (+25%) it can get competitive damage.
Regarding crafting skills, I read in Steam forums in Destroyor's FAQ (great work btw) that I would normally need ~120 effective skill, but I'll consider giving up the Crawler traps...ouch. Also, it would be nice to swap into throwing, so that I can throw a flashbang at 4 tiles away with +-2 tiles precision (typically how much throwing you guys use?)
All in all, the focus was to keep as many enemies CC'ed as possible by having many offensive actions and having all do some CC (damn you incendiary bullets...)
I still found 2 key questions in my mind that could impact all the previous thought process:
-Will I be able to CC enemies with Psi abilities in DC, so that I can neglect their evasion and have a chance at shooting at them?
-Does Special Tactics cooldown start AFTER you fire the 1st bolt (so that by incapacitating everyone you can use it again after 30s), or does it take 30s AFTER you close combat?
Vile Weaponry shouldn't work with guns as they're not cold weapons.
Oh no, I got it wrong! You're right, I just tested it, this made the 1st build much less appealing. The Wiki used to say any wound would apply it (even tho in the feat requirements you can guess it). My bad!
My gut feeling is that spreading yourself so thin would make your offensive ability significantly weaker than other builds in the late game, and that the free attacks wouldn't make up for the lack of specialisation, but I'm interested in the idea of a build focused on free attacks, regardless. If you try it, let us know how it goes.
I'll do :) I'm very curious too to see how far it can get, but I'll have to wait until those 2 bugs are fixed.
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edit: don't feel like doubleposting, so here.
-Will I be able to CC enemies with Psi abilities in DC, so that I can neglect their evasion and have a chance at shooting at them?
-Does Special Tactics cooldown start AFTER you fire the 1st bolt (so that by incapacitating everyone you can use it again after 30s), or does it take 30s AFTER you close combat?
- Sure, why not? It's not that different from rest of the game, but there's a lot of enemy variation - some have rather high mechanical resistance (bad particularly for crossbows), some are immune to crits, and your character will be generally less effective in combat under certain effects. Also, depending on your choices you might have to fight enemies that can temporarily inhibit psi, so knowing how to craft psi reinvigorators might be useful.
- Special Tactics cooldown starts as soon as you activate the ability, so it's even better than you expected.
That is good news. Enemy variety sounds like fun. Against high-resistance enemies I could resort to W2C bullets and use bolts/Psi as CC, and getting inhibited shouldn't be catastrophic. Things being inmune to crits is not fun tho...
That makes Special Tactics INSANELY good (in the right circumstances)! I am looking forward to trying it out. Ahhh, I don't want to wait!
Thanks a lot! I'll keep this post updated once I start.
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Hi again!
Based on your advice I thought of reworking QBit2 a bit. Let's see how it goes...
I dropped STR to 3, losing ARs & FullAuto and metal armors & MetalSloping, and picked SMG and light armor as replacements.
To compensate, I raised PER to 15, picked Opportunist, so SMG gets multiplied by 1'25(Oppor)*1'2(PER11->15)=1'4, similar to previous AR with FullAuto.
This also made crossbow waay better, and also Ambush, mobility and sneaking, since the armor penalty is small now.
Also, I picked Pyromaniac to compensate the lack of incendiary rounds (damn I wish I had another spare feat to pick PowerManagement).
Finally, I dropped traps, and Psychokinesis a bit, to give Crafting 15-20 extra points and make it relevant.
http://underrail.info.tm/build/?AwGloJgVhBmEb3gRhs0B2EzY1DvMIgFnCLIE4IQKZjqMA2GtWY7YandsyOJdrAAcIeqPjFmUZo2QhG8DIrTAUwZsghCgA (http://underrail.info.tm/build/?AwGloJgVhBmEb3gRhs0B2EzY1DvMIgFnCLIE4IQKZjqMA2GtWY7YandsyOJdrAAcIeqPjFmUZo2QhG8DIrTAUwZsghCgA)
(https://i.imgur.com/GGdYVXP.jpg)
Damage-wise, even without high DEX, I reckon the lategame raw damage of the SMG is only 10% inferior to the AR, around 1000/10AP, with crossbows being similar, 1200/10AP, all before reductions (I might be completely wrong, have no clue about the exact formulas ^^).
Heck, with adrenaline & rathound barbeque I could even use ARs (don't think it's worth however)!
Dunno if without metal armor I will survive those high-iniciative grenadiers or pesky psiers tho...
Any comments are appreciated. Was fun!
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How the hell do you get 1000 damage per 10 AP with SMGs? Or 1200 with crossbows? But more importantly, SMGs with such a low Dex and no Spec Ops are just... really shitty assault rifles.
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Hmmm... maybe an SMG coupled with an Xbow is not such a crazy idea as it sounds. The Xbow is a ranged sniper weapon, and the SMG is move and shoot, in the enemys face, perfect backup weapon. They complement each other well, but skills and feats will be scarce.
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How the hell do you get 1000 damage per 10 AP with SMGs? Or 1200 with crossbows? But more importantly, SMGs with such a low Dex and no Spec Ops are just... really shitty assault rifles.
Thanks all for the replies,
I find SMGs interesting, as an execution/low-range backup weapon, despite this build not being optimised for them.
My math is probably wrong. Anyway, the idea was to get relative numbers between SMG, Xbow & AR.
This way, given the same errors, I could check if SMG was a waste or not.
I'll post what I used, maybe you can find my mistakes and better check it ("m"=multiplier, "p"=probability):
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Smart Rapid SteelCat7.62mm (~Q150)
Damage: 3*mean(8-24) = 48 (big assumption, I multiplied Q50 dmg by 3 to get Q150 dmg)
Base action points: 13 AP
Critical chance: 5%
Critical damage bonus: 120%
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GUNS = 135*(1+0.085*(PER-4)) = 261
mGUNS = 1+(0.5*GUNS/71.5) = 2.83
mCALIB = 3*16 = 48
mAP = 10/30 = 0.33 (0.8*13~11, becomes 10 with DEX6, then 3*10 and finally normalise per 10 AP)
mADDS = 1.4*5 = 7 (Smart Module +40%, standard 5 bullets)
mOPPOR = 1.25 (Opportunist feat)
mCrit = 2+2.5*0.2 = 2.5
pCrit = 0.15+0.15+0.20+0.40+0.05 = 0.95 (SeekersNVG+Stim+PsychostaticElectricity+Ambush+weapon)
DMG_10AP = mOPPOR*mGUNS*mCALIB*mAP*mADDS*((1-pCrit)+pCrit*mCrit)
DMG_10AP = 1.25 *2.83 *48 *0.33*7 *2.43
DMG_10AP = 959
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Not to mention that having all those stars alligned brings plenty of light for Ambush to trigger. Should respec more points into Stealth :P
To complete the theorycrafting, could I ask you about typical endgame Cyclon/Zephyr damage?
This formula looks trickier, since I don't know which multipliers applies to the elemental damage. I reckon for the Cyclon:
mXBOW = 1+(0.5*XBOW/71.5)
dmgBASE: is the weapon base damage
dmgELEM: is the special bolt elemental damage
DMG_10AP = 1.25 * mAP * ((1-pCrit)+pCrit*mCrit) * mXBOW * [dmgBASE + 2*dmgELEM]
DMG_10AP = 1.25 * 10/17 * 4 * 2.83 * [2*23 + 2*40 ]
DMG_10AP = 1200 1050 ;D lol
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Most dynamic components have quality scaling tables on their wiki pages, at this point only firearms and melee weapons are missing. Gotta get all their formulas and figure out where to put all that info. Maybe on blueprint pages. I'll get to it eventually.
A bit off topic, but i just wanted to say that your work on wiki is highly appreciated. Thanks, man)
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Given that this is 7.62mm damage calculation, perhaps it should account for the special bullet - micro shrapnel as well?
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http://www.underrail.com/wiki/index.php?title=Crossbow_Parts:_Cyclon
http://www.underrail.com/wiki/index.php?title=Crossbow_Parts:_Zephyr
Most dynamic components have quality scaling tables on their wiki pages, at this point only firearms and melee weapons are missing. Gotta get all their formulas and figure out where to put all that info. Maybe on blueprint pages. I'll get to it eventually.
edit:
Nooothing! Well, that used to be the case for the longest time. Crit multiplier applies nowadays. And Elemental Bolts too.
Hi,
I too thank your help a lot Epeli. The wiki makes planning really easy and pleasant. It's superb.
So from what you say I understand I should expect ~Q120 damage for Cyclon/Zephyr, about 39'5/44.
W.r.t. the formula, the crossbow skill multiplier (mXBOW) shouldn't apply to the elemental bolt dmg:
DMG_10AP = 1.25 * mAP * ((1-pCrit)+pCrit*mCrit) * [mXBOW*dmgBASE + 2*dmgELEM] = 570
It sounds fair considering how much CC you can get from it.
Given that this is 7.62mm damage calculation, perhaps it should account for the special bullet - micro shrapnel as well?
Yeah, that would make it perhaps 50% more? But then at that point I don't know if you would be resorting to W2C bullets :-\
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Wait, does critical nowadays also affect elemental damage of e.g. electrical knifes or shock round SMGs, not only special bolts?
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Oh,
I see now, whenever these weapons make reference to a % percentage it means it will take the total and thus all the modifiers into account.
Whenever I see fixed values then these are isolated (except for special bolts as you say).
Many thanks Epeli! :)
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I gave it another thought, and realising acib blob pistol would trigger Deadly Snares (and corrode armor), came to an even thinner spread build:
http://underrail.info.tm/build/?AwGloJgVhBmEAcdkEYIhaA7BtiBsGsM4YIALKafiiAJzoMhbyzxMqzqifdmRxW5OEnLpy8ckiiEaIfPCwwshBLUyE0CIA
Attributes:
Str: 3
Dex: 7->8 @lvl12 (9 with Eel sandwich)
Agi: 3
Con: 3
Per: 10->12 @lvl4,8
Will: 8->10 @lvl16,20
Int: 6->7 @lvl24
Feats:
1: Opportunist
1: Marksman
2: Tranquility
4: Thermodynamicity
6: Premeditation
8: Special Tactics
10: Ambush
12: Fatal throw
14: Critical Power
16: Deadly Snares
18: Elemental Bolts
20: Locus of Control
22: Quick Tinkering
24: Bowyer
Offensive all-in, CC machine. Reliable flashbangs (tranquilising bolt if few enemies) and incendiary grenades (or incendiary bolts) for Special Tactics and Ambush respectively. Quick tinkering for melees or for placing mines near the crowd then throw some fireworks. Having 3 sources now (Ambush with good Stealth gear, acid pistols and traps), it should be more realistic to assume I'll be critically hitting quite often.
12 Per instead of 16 however, but CC & Ambush should solve the precision issue. Fatal Throw for that neat execution + 3 AP so that you can shoot 3 times with a 17AP cyclon. No Psychokynesis since shock bolts should do the job for less AP.
I won't craft Spirit Poison but saved ~40 skill points, much needed elsewhere. No lockpicking/hacking/evasion (tailoring/electronics could be removed but I feel like they are overall better options). I should still be able to try the cool guns, just for fun. A SMG wouldn't be that bad for situations where acid pistol is not needed due to the other 2 sources.
Any thoughts about it? :)
-Would you pick Pyromaniac instead of Thermodynamicity?
-Is Thermodynamicity AP reduction applied before Tranquility (e.g. Cryostasis for free) or the other way around (Cryostasis for 2 AP)?
And btw I don't know if I should wait for the expansion or the patch prior to it... :-\
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Tranquility does apply after, so you do get Cryostasis for 0 AP with Thermodynamicity.
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That's pretty pretty nice. Thnx for the pic !
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Unrelated to this thread, but I'm thinking of rolling a tank psionic build. My starting stats are 8/3/3/5/3/10/8 so I can go for metal armor, and I want a lot of base int for a tech skill boost. I want to be able to craft morphine shots, metal armor and a good energy shield going by the time I enter Depot A. I'm probably gonna be investing into melee as well for a sledgehammer as an offhand weapon. Should I invest in Psychosis or Tranquility if I plan on taking this build?
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I gave it another thought, and realising acib blob pistol would trigger Deadly Snares (and corrode armor), came to an even thinner spread build:
http://underrail.info.tm/build/?AwGloJgVhBmEAcdkEYIhaA7BtiBsGsM4YIALKafiiAJzoMhbyzxMqzqifdmRxW5OEnLpy8ckiiEaIfPCwwshBLUyE0CIA
Attributes:
Str: 3
Dex: 7->8 @lvl12 (9 with Eel sandwich)
Agi: 3
Con: 3
Per: 10->12 @lvl4,8
Will: 8->10 @lvl16,20
Int: 6->7 @lvl24
Feats:
1: Opportunist
1: Marksman
2: Tranquility
4: Thermodynamicity
6: Premeditation
8: Special Tactics
10: Ambush
12: Fatal throw
14: Critical Power
16: Deadly Snares
18: Elemental Bolts
20: Locus of Control
22: Quick Tinkering
24: Bowyer
Offensive all-in, CC machine. Reliable flashbangs (tranquilising bolt if few enemies) and incendiary grenades (or incendiary bolts) for Special Tactics and Ambush respectively. Quick tinkering for melees or for placing mines near the crowd then throw some fireworks. Having 3 sources now (Ambush with good Stealth gear, acid pistols and traps), it should be more realistic to assume I'll be critically hitting quite often.
12 Per instead of 16 however, but CC & Ambush should solve the precision issue. Fatal Throw for that neat execution + 3 AP so that you can shoot 3 times with a 17AP cyclon. No Psychokynesis since shock bolts should do the job for less AP.
I won't craft Spirit Poison but saved ~40 skill points, much needed elsewhere. No lockpicking/hacking/evasion (tailoring/electronics could be removed but I feel like they are overall better options). I should still be able to try the cool guns, just for fun. A SMG wouldn't be that bad for situations where acid pistol is not needed due to the other 2 sources.
Any thoughts about it? :)
-Would you pick Pyromaniac instead of Thermodynamicity?
-Is Thermodynamicity AP reduction applied before Tranquility (e.g. Cryostasis for free) or the other way around (Cryostasis for 2 AP)?
And btw I don't know if I should wait for the expansion or the patch prior to it... :-\
I think you are too weak in defense.
Sure you have many options when going first, but your initiative is poor, your health is very poor and no evasion or armor.
I predict that you will have to save and reload a lot, when you get surprised, get an unlucky initiative roll, step on a mine, get a grenade thrown at you, screw up your movement etc...
With such a character you need to be ok with seeing the death screen a lot.
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I'm thinking of rolling a tank psionic build. [...] Should I invest in Psychosis or Tranquility if I plan on taking this build?
Tank builds tend to endure, and endurance builds benefit more from Tranquility. Burst builds favor Psychosis. That said, you haven't given enough information for me to be 100% sure what playstyle you'll end up using. A heavy psychotic psipuncher with strong thermo is perfectly valid and quite dangerous, though you're likely going to want to play around with those base stats just a little. Despite my opening sentence, if you plan on stacking a very high armor penalty you'd probably benefit more from Psychosis. If you plan to keep your penalty low with Super Steel (and perhaps Nimble) then definitely go Tranq.
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I think you are too weak in defense.
Sure you have many options when going first, but your initiative is poor, your health is very poor and no evasion or armor.
I predict that you will have to save and reload a lot, when you get surprised, get an unlucky initiative roll, step on a mine, get a grenade thrown at you, screw up your movement etc...
With such a character you need to be ok with seeing the death screen a lot.
Having high Electronics but low Evasion & HP (Psi-Empathy too), would Power Management instead of Tranquility help significatively? Midgame onwards.
+35% shield HP sounds way better than 125 Evasion or a few points in Con (which I can't spare).
Skinner instead of Opportunist is another option, but I can't estimate how good that improvement is, and Opportunist sounds amazing with all this CC.
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Regarding the psi melee, I agree with what has been said above.
High evasion & shield (and possibly things like Yell, or other debuffs) sounds great when you try to have Tranquility up all the time.
High Con (Survival Instintcs +30% crit chance) & metal armor with Psychosis to get as close as possible to 100% chance.
My 2 cents as a str-will-con psier. Superslam, Critical Power & Heavyweight sounds like fun melee crits to me !
http://underrail.info.tm/build/?AwGloJgVhBGUDMIkE5lxk8Y4Jt7ADlh1FjzggHYcUl4AWXGcligkQ5JBnphgGwgBJKjEJNCMFNKEou8CHGD1gUIA
Conditioning, Juggernaut & Stoicism with metal armor so that enemies mostly do scratches to you. No Premeditation tho...
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+35% shield HP sounds way better than 125 Evasion or a few points in Con (which I can't spare).
It's worse actually) Half of the attacks just don't care about shield, because even low frequency module in shield gives a very small amount of damage reduction for low impact attacks. So, any melee or crossbow guy, wouldn't even notice your shield, and with 3 Con + psionic health reduction, aimed shot form a crossbow will often mean instant death.
125 evasion can actually turn into a decent number with stuff like high quality tabi boots and infused siphoner leather armor, especially if you use drugs like Jumping Bean. Though even that would help only so much because a) without dodge, melee guys would still mess you up b) with your health and no decent armor someone sneezing near you can send you to reload screen.
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+35% shield HP sounds way better than 125 Evasion or a few points in Con (which I can't spare).
It's worse actually) Half of the attacks just don't care about shield, because even low frequency module in shield gives a very small amount of damage reduction for low impact attacks. So, any melee or crossbow guy, wouldn't even notice your shield, and with 3 Con + psionic health reduction, aimed shot form a crossbow will often mean instant death.
125 evasion can actually turn into a decent number with stuff like high quality tabi boots and infused siphoner leather armor, especially if you use drugs like Jumping Bean. Though even that would help only so much because a) without dodge, melee guys would still mess you up b) with your health and no decent armor someone sneezing near you can send you to reload screen.
Yep, this is unfortunate but true.
My knowledge of underrail is limited, but there are simply a lot of circumstances that you cant control. Like dialogue-initiated combat (no stealth opener, only initiative roll). Or high stealth melee enemies, stabbing you in the back unless you have REALLY good stealth and detection. You cant turn on your shield if you are incapacitated or dead.
A critical hit from an X-bow, like MirddinEmris mentions, or a grenade hitting you right in the body, means instant death if you have so low HPs, no armor or evasion. Stepping on a mine will also happen occationally even if your detection is decent.
I like to play as close to Ironman as possible, and get really annoyed when I die. Usually I could have avoided death, in retrospect, or I screw up by for example stepping in my own bear trap in the middle of a close shave combat.
But I try to make a character who can survive as well as possible. And the weak 3-STR, 3-CON, no evasion/dodge builds so popular here, always see the death screen eventually.
If I were to make a character with three CON, I would always have high AGI, stealth+evasion+dodge. Even this will not save you from psionics always, who cant miss.
If you are cool with the occational quickload, then you'll get by, I suppose.
If not, like me, then you got to plan your character not by "what can I do to my enemies when I have first strike", but "what happens when I get jumped". Being able to survive one round of incoming fire is the best, and that unfortunately means decent or high CON, and/or good armor. This limits your offensive capability, so you have to have a good plan. But this is just my personal preference.
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Regarding the psi melee, I agree with what has been said above.
High evasion & shield (and possibly things like Yell, or other debuffs) sounds great when you try to have Tranquility up all the time.
High Con (Survival Instintcs +30% crit chance) & metal armor with Psychosis to get as close as possible to 100% chance.
My 2 cents as a str-will-con psier. Superslam, Critical Power & Heavyweight sounds like fun melee crits to me !
http://underrail.info.tm/build/?AwGloJgVhBGUDMIkE5lxk8Y4Jt7ADlh1FjzggHYcUl4AWXGcligkQ5JBnphgGwgBJKjEJNCMFNKEou8CHGD1gUIA
Conditioning, Juggernaut & Stoicism with metal armor so that enemies mostly do scratches to you. No Premeditation tho...
Interesting, but since you're gonna be in melee range wouldn't it be better to swap it out for psionic mania, or force user?
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A critical hit from an X-bow, like MirddinEmris mentions, or a grenade hitting you right in the body, means instant death if you have so low HPs, no armor or evasion.
Well, at least shield CAN protect you form a grenade, and that what i was talking about.
What bothers me with this build most of all is the though about him fighting in the arena with 11 initiative, no evasion/dodge and 3 Con + psionic health reduction. I mean, it would be a massacre. Especially with Carnifex. Actually, i don't think it is even possible for this build to win at all. Initiative 11 against 29 is 100% loss, since random component goes only as far as 15 (if wiki doesn't lie). Even if he takes Paranoia it's like less than half of a percent chance to win it. Maybe, if he creates some sort of super armor and tries to survive the first round (most probably suffering penalty for not having enough Str fof this armor), but even that is a long shot. I don't think that this build is actually viable for full playthrough)
P.S. Oops, been looking on different build. His has 16 initiative, giving him a wooping 0.44% chance to go first. It'll go up to 9.33% if he takes Paranoia feat.
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No Premeditation tho...
I would actually go so far as to say any psi build without Premeditation is wrong. Not saying it's unwinnable, mind you, but if you have psi and use it pretty much every battle, then there is no single perk that is better than Premeditation.
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Wait, dieing in one turn against Carnifex sounds ridiculous. So in 1 turn he gets to close all the distance and kill you? Dex based with steel gloves..like 7 attacks per turn, raw 150 dmg each?
From what I read, he's mechanical melee dmg, in that case shield only blocks 20% of its normal capacity. Then I am wondering..even if I wear Infused Ancient rathound leather & metal boots & helmet I die? wow that's insane.
Besides, if my initiative is 17 (+1 dex) and his is 29, and roll is -+15, that leaves me with -12, so I win 3/15 of the times and he 11/15 (tie 1/15), meaning ~20% chance for me to start? Dunno if I got it right.
At this point, this build offers little variation, except for additionally sacrifying 2 points of Per into Con (+50HP). This made me even more interested in playing it hehe :)
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Wait, dieing in one turn against Carnifex sounds ridiculous. So in 1 turn he gets to close all the distance and kill you? Dex based with steel gloves..like 7 attacks per turn, raw 150 dmg each?
Quite a bit more than 150, he also will entangle (he throws nets) and debuff you with yell. He also has a chance to incapacitate you. He also has 700 health and pretty high dodge/evasion. You don't get to be a legendary champion of the Arena by collecting coupons, you know) Overall he can do what a optimized unarmed build can.
From what I read, he's mechanical melee dmg, in that case shield only blocks 20% of its normal capacity. Then I am wondering..even if I wear Infused Ancient rathound leather & metal boots & helmet I die? wow that's insane.
Less. Combat gloves ignore 80% of your shield additionally. For the most part, shield will do close to nothing against melee opponents. Depending on the quality of the leather and components, you maybe has a small chance of surviving first round.
Besides, if my initiative is 17 (+1 dex) and his is 29, and roll is -+15, that leaves me with -12, so I win 3/15 of the times and he 11/15 (tie 1/15), meaning ~20% chance for me to start? Dunno if I got it right.
You have to refresh you memory on how probabilities actually work, mate) You have 1.33% chance of winning the initiative with additional +1 dex. You have to roll at least 14 while he has to roll no higher than 3 (a bit more complex in actual equation, i'm simplifying here) at the same time. Also, i think he wins on tie since he got higher base bonus, but i'm not sure about that. If he doesn't, you get 2.66% of winning initiative.
At this point, this build offers little variation, except for additionally sacrifying 2 points of Per into Con (+50HP). This made me even more interested in playing it hehe
Mate, you are still squishy as hell, and he still gonna kill you in one round, most probably. You also reduced your chances of hitting stuff and damage you are gonna deal. At which point you are better playing regular psion.
Also, i already gave you an advice - take Paranoia feat. At the very least, you gonna have reasonable chances of winning initiative (1 in 11), meaning that you can actually have a drop on him and having less reload screens in total in your playthrough (way less).
You are not gonna enjoy it, really, unless you enjoy reloading every fight several times over. Build with no health, no armor, no evasion/dodge, no initiative and little to no stealth....well, you are in for a ride. I think you gonna drop this game way before even getting to Arena.
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Also, i think he wins on tie since he got higher base bonus, but i'm not sure about that.
I did a lot of tests and it feels totally random, but enemies tend to go first if a tie happens. Safer to assume it's 1.(3)%.
I agree he will have a really hard time with a build like this. 3 CON + Psi empathy means HP will be as low as it can possibly be, no stealth or high initative means he won't be able to reliably act first. Crafted infused siphoner leather tabis (immunity to immoblization so no bonus damage from Opportunist) and infused pig leather armor with high-density padding (relatively high mechanical DR and bonus DR vs. melee, +1 CON and up to 100+ flat HP bonus on top of that) *might* be enough to make him survive the first turn against Carnifex, not sure though.
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Crafted infused siphoner leather tabis (immunity to immoblization so no bonus damage from Opportunist)
Those are must not even because of opportunist, but because without them, he's gonna get entangled on first turn (no evasion) and then die on a second because with him standing in one place, he can't use Quick Tinkering and this is one way for him to keep good old Carni at a distance.
I agree he will have a really hard time with a build like this.
I'm not sure he will even pass first part. Most OP psi skills will not be available yet and with his defense and stealth...oh, well.
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I checked the probability and you're right, I oversimplified it :( I'll be forced to drop some offensive stuff, damn, I'll think what to leave behind (or ditch it completely).
Thnx for the feedback, you rock !
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Wait, both fist/knife and crossbow enemies suffer 125% damage resistance & treshold.
So if I could somehow achieve 60-80% mechanical resistance I would actually resist 75-95% of the dmg? metal armor for those combats? skinner?
Would I get near that by the time I get to the Arena? 35 AP ocassionally might not be that bad
Actually I would like to understand Skinner/crafting better:
If I had Q120 Ancient Rathound leather and Q160 fiber, would I get Q200 Infused Ancient leather? and need:
Tailoring: 0.8*120+0.8*160 = 224 ?
Mechanics: 0.2*160 = 32 ?
Then, would I get Q240 Infused Ancient armor (due to Skinner)?
I couldn't get it clear from Destroyor's encyclopedia.
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On Skinner and crafting:
If you have Q114 Ancient Rathound leather and Q160 SS fiber, you would get Q196 Infused Ancient leather. At this point, it doesn't matter if you have Skinner or not as the quality of your infused leather is unaffected by Skinner. The quality is strictly based on your source materials.
Now on the next part: Infused Ancient Rathound leather armor:
You won't see any quality # on your leather armor. Your leather quality will determine various bonuses, for example:
With Skinner:
Q187 Infused Ancient Rathound leather => leather armor = Resistances: Mechanical: 51%/25 Cold: 37%/15 All heat (and cold) damage taken reduced by 23%
Q196 Infused Ancient Rathound leather => leather armor = Resistances: Mechanical: 53%/26 Cold: 38%/15 All heat (and cold) damage taken reduced by 24%
Without Skinner:
Q187 Infused Ancient Rathound leather => leather armor = Resistances: Mechanical: 45%/21 Cold: 34%/13 All heat (and cold) damage taken reduced by 19%
Q196 Infused Ancient Rathound leather => leather armor = Resistances: Mechanical: 46%/22 Cold: 35%/13 All heat (and cold) damage taken reduced by 20%
@lewis_cb - theorycrafting is fun and all, but you should start and play a game for real so you'll see how some combo just won't work and/or work very poorly.
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Many thanks Destroyor.
Yes. I will soon try this out myself, to see if it would be doable to play it my way.
I already ditched 2 playthroughs midgame. I want to maximise the chances of completing the game this 3rd time.
I decided to make CON3->5 at the cost of PER12->10. I'd like to increase the survivability without dumping a skill for Evasion/Dodge.
Lastly, in your opinion, which 2 feats would you pick earlygame between Conditioning, Power Management, Skinner & Opportunist?
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Without question - Conditioning
The others will depends on your build and play style, but in general:
Opportunist > Skinner > Power Management.
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Is it possible to properly use Balor's hammer in the game currently? I know I can get up to 19 strength with the rat hound regalia, power fist, and bbq. I was thinking of trying a sledgehammer build centered around this
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If you scum Junkyard Surprise or just cook a bunch of Super Soldier drug you don't even need to wear the fairly crappy Rathound Regalia to get 19 STR. The penalty for using Balor's Hammer with 19 STR is very small. There are some posts with detailed analysis of the damage breakdown, but the general wisdom seems to be that Balor's Hammer is about as good as a high quality TiChrome shock hammer, but the advantage to the shock hammer is that it doesn't require so much micromanagement to use properly. I can attest from playing a hammer build that a good TiChrome shock hammer with lifting belt deals a very impressive amount of damage, even with a relatively measly 12 STR.
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There are some posts with detailed analysis of the damage breakdown, but the general wisdom seems to be that Balor's Hammer is about as good as a high quality TiChrome shock hammer
You mean way better than TiChrome hammer, right?)
The main problem with Balor's is required investment and being able to use it properly only after lvl 16-20. Main idea is to put maximum amount into Str and when you have at least 14 you use rathound barbeque and adrenaline. Adrenaline is mostly known for giving you +20 AP for 3 turns, but it's less known property is giving you +2 Str. You suffer -5% accuracy (on top of final calculation) for each point of Str lacking. With 19 Str it's just 5%, meaning 90% maximum accuracy. Don't bother wearing stuff like rathound armor, you will loose much more than you gain.
I can provide some numbers if you want, but overall Balor's damage output is just WAY more even with the loss of 1 hit per turn compared to TiChrome. It also will leave you with 10 additional AP per turn free which you can use for medicine or taser (you have to wear lifting belt of course).
I did heavy sledge playthrough and used both TiChrome and Balor. For any serious battle i used Balor's and by the time Adrenaline wore off, either all or most enemies were dead, at which point i switched to TiChrome if there was a need to. Balor Hammer is difficult to use, but if you can, it will be very effective. It's actually one of the rare cases when unique weapon doesn't suck balls (rest of the unique hammers do, unfortunately).
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You mean way better than TiChrome hammer, right?
No, I don't. The raw damage output is noticeably higher with Balor's Hammer, but there are several significant drawbacks as well. If all you care about is theorycrafted output, then it's a very simple comparison. But for many encounters, the drawbacks exceed the raw damage value of Balor's. So I mean it's about as good. Ideally, you'd carry one of each because sometimes one is better than the other; and it's not always Balor's Hammer that shines.
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Is it possible to properly use Balor's hammer in the game currently?
Yes, also you could use it only in lategame, or as early as midgame at least.
Despite all claims, you can use Rathound Regala - I kill Balor in this armor.
All short fights are bearable as long as you don't allow to hit you much.
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Hi,
After Santa's gift, I took the bowman dossier out of the filing cabinet. I have my masochism ready for DOMINATING.
I've replanned him, without Psi, as acid pistol + acid critical bolts (+50% dmg with new belt), some HP, Evasion & Stealth...
http://underrail.info.tm/build/?GQMIAwYQAwfCh3XChwAAbm4AOwA9WjtXLkcAAAAAAAAIASYwAlE4IkxLasKRwoAz
Attributes: str-3 dex-8 agi-3 con-6 per-16 wil-3 int-7
Feats: Conditioning, Aimed Shot, Opportunist, Quick Tinkering, Ambush, Fatal Throw, Special Tactics, Marksman, Deadly Snares, Critical Power, Elemental Bolts, Cooked Shot, Bowyer, Sharpshooter
My question is, would you guys pick Aimed Shot & Sharpshooter, or Point Shot & Grenadier?
The former looks solid early and extra 75% dmg lategame, but the latter sounds like cheap chem pistol CC & AoE option (many swarms?)...
I can't make up my mind, perhaps you can share some of your experience and tips.
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I'm not an expert in such exotic builds and don't even want to analize it, but I can tell you that probably your 6 Con and Conditioning won't do much to you, put 10 in Dex and 4 in Con and you will have free feat.
A good - really good with you Perception score - replacement for Conditioning is Paranoia, you probably might be able to see Death Stalkers with it and good quality motion tracking googles.
Also, you do understand, that you need to take Elemental Bolts as early as possible which is lvl 14 right?
Also, Critical Power is as important for you (I think) as Elemental Bolts, and it is too lvl 14 feat.
Without this, your strategy won't work.
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Hi,
Thanks for the comments. I will need to consider that option.
Paranoia gives sweet +55 Detection plus 5 Initiative & -3% critically hit, but I'd lose ~110HP lategame.
Does it happen that if they reach you you are instadead?
Also, you do understand, that you need to take Elemental Bolts as early as possible which is lvl 14 right?
Also, Critical Power is as important for you (I think) as Elemental Bolts, and it is too lvl 14 feat.
You are right it's an issue. I thought of picking Deadly Snares @14, Elemental Bolts@16 and Critical Power @18 (the order of these 2 depending on Bowyer).
Regarding Grenadier, I found an issue. Catalyst belt provides no utility slots, so I'll have 2 but need 3 or 4 (special bolt(s), grenade(s), throwing knife)...I could use utility belt when facing swarms and catalyst belt otherwise, but this might not justify picking Grenadier. I'm hesitant about Ambush too...Quick Pockets seems an option now.
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Not instadeath if you get yourself proper armor, but it would be preferable to not let them hit you if you can.
Maybe Conditioning is a better option, because sometimes two of them attack at same time or short after first attacked.
Anyway, I playing 3 Con Agent Orange aka remember Vietnam aka chem gun build, so I expect to survive them anyway.
I thought of picking Deadly Snares @14, Elemental Bolts@16 and Critical Power @18 (the order of these 2 depending on Bowyer). ------ no that's too late, if someone is in the trap, he is dead anyway or disabled, Quick Tinkering is all you need, consider to throw Deadly Snares away, because you only could get it at second half of the game, because before there are more essential feats you need to take.
I don't know about Grenadier, I don't like those grenade feats because I always play builds that require many feats, so I even try to not use grenades at all.
Ambush is great if you have ways to make it work.
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God of the RNG, please forgive me, I decided to sacrifice the remaining defensive feat...your advice made a solid point. CC will have to do!
Conditioning looks like 1 extra CON, therefore I'll start playing now with 4CON and if permadying I'll drop 1/2 PER into CON. Also, I'll get to see if Quick Pockets, Grenadier, Ambush & Fatal Throw are trully worthy.
http://underrail.info.tm/build/?GQMKAwQQAwfCh3XChwAAbm4AOwA9WjtXLkcAAAAAAAAmIi8wWcKROMKAS2pMFgJR
I reckon I'll need Ambush for those turns where enemies are far away and Acid Pistol + Deadly Snares is unavailable. Quick Pockets to have incendiary bolts, together with Grenadier should make the build fun. It should also fill the missing role of swarm control with Flashbangs & Molotovs (no Psi).
Fatal Throw for...I don't know really...free execution + 4 AP? Ocassionally allow 3 bolts...perhaps Paranoia could fit here.
Back when I planned to have 8DEX it was important because chem pistol costed 18AP, but now with 10DEX it costs 16AP and fits perfectly with 2 bolts (34AP).
I thought of picking Deadly Snares @14, Elemental Bolts@16 and Critical Power @18 (the order of these 2 depending on Bowyer). ------ no that's too late, if someone is in the trap, he is dead anyway or disabled, Quick Tinkering is all you need, consider to throw Deadly Snares away, because you only could get it at second half of the game, because before there are more essential feats you need to take.
Ambush is great if you have ways to make it work.
I put Ambush & Bowyer early on, so the order will be finally : Critical Power @14, Elemental Bolts@16, Deadly Snares @18.
Thanks for the feedback man, I read about your build (Hilf's) in RPGCodex and sounds very fun, hope u're enjoying it.
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There is at least one problem - if you take chem guns for their effects, then they won't work without Mad Chemist, because it doubles chance to proc these effects.
If just for +50% elemental damage, then fine.
I still think that Deadly Snares is an overkill, but actually it was for Hard, not sure if it's overkill now with +50% hp.
Anyway, you have no room for it, or you can take it very late in game, I think you'll reconsider about it, so don't pour skilpoints in Traps more then needed for QT.
If you want to make trapsless detectable, bear in mind that if you set trap around the cornet, even if you have 0 skill, most likely NPC trigger trap because he won't have time to detect it. Also, in a fight they detect traps very badly.
Paranoia is quite useful, especially with that huge amount of Per.
On Domination everyone who has stealth, has good stealth.
Also, my advice - don't go to Lurker territory early on, and even later, they tear you apart without good firepower, or good defence or good crowd control.
I can't even reliable hit them without reloadfest on 15 lvl with 10 Per.
Edit Wait, I misinformed you. Without Mad Chemist damage of the on-hit effects will be 1/2 right?
Or what? I'm a little confused.
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Mad Chemist doesn't change chance to proc, it doubles damage of DOTs and duration of cold debuffs.
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Thanks, then Mad Chemist has no use in thin build.
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Yes, it's a pitty Mad Chemist doesn't work like that, since Chem Pistols seem to be designed for that CC role.
Btw, chance to CC for acid pistols suck compared to incendiary pistols...I guess it's because acid is less resisted but still.
I still think that Deadly Snares is an overkill, but actually it was for Hard, not sure if it's overkill now with +50% hp.
Anyway, you have no room for it, or you can take it very late in game, I think you'll reconsider about it, so don't pour skilpoints in Traps more then needed for QT.
If you want to make trapsless detectable, bear in mind that if you set trap around the cornet, even if you have 0 skill, most likely NPC trigger trap because he won't have time to detect it. Also, in a fight they detect traps very badly.
My idea was not to solely rely on Ambush. I can be wrong, but this way, I can still achieve criticals against burning-immune enemies or in iluminated places. Not many great alternatives IMO. I will keep trap skill high since there could be no corners.
Paranoia is quite useful, especially with that huge amount of Per.
On Domination everyone who has stealth, has good stealth.
Also, my advice - don't go to Lurker territory early on, and even later, they tear you apart without good firepower, or good defence or good crowd control.
I can't even reliable hit them without reloadfest on 15 lvl with 10 Per.
That's insane. Those gave me a lot of headaches on Hard difficulty in the past...
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There is something else I'd like to ask.
Does someone know if elemental bolt damage benefit from critical multiplier boosts like Bowyer or Sharpshooter?
E.g. whether on a critical hit acid dmg from acid bolt is multiplied by say 3'5 or just by 2.
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Yes, that's why you can achieve good damage with over the 1 K crits with crossbow.
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Nice! :)